The Evolution Deceit

The simple fact that a man like Harun Yehia exists and that some read his "works(!)"proves that,at least for some,evolution have not happened yet.

:)

this book is for believers, not rational people

thanks for this book and related site

" Posted By: Nokios Date: 03 Aug 2007 12:29
The simple fact that a man like Harun Yehia exists and that some read his "works(!)"proves that,at least for some,evolution have not happened yet."

Well i don't want get into a debate but because of Harun Yahya people can learn that evolution is a lie.

The USA is heading to where the Muslim world is - backward.

A few centuries back the Muslim world was advanced and enlightened - it explored and adopted new ideas. Then it became superstitious and ignored science and the advances it made. Now most Muslim countries don't even have flushing toilets!

If you want to see what the USA will be in less than 100 years - check out the Muslim countries in the Middle East.

You're welcome to your ignorant belief that a magic pixie created the world... just remember that when your grandchildren don't have running water.

ROFLMA

Thank you for the book.

There are a lot of aspects that are not clear in the evolution theory.

How sad. Who could ever have imagined that the human capacity for thoughtful investigation should be used to produce a book like this in 2007. Maybe that's all we are, semi-rational and scared beings too afraid to live without some Grand Plan. Life is too wonderful in all its paradoxes to be dragged into the mud by books such as this.

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I haven't read the book and maybe (or even probably) it's not worth reading it. BUT, last time I checked, the Evolution theory was just - a theory, not a "fact", especially not a "scientific fact" (Darwin himself - and no one after him either - could not explain evolution of some organs, e.g. human eye). But that aside, strictly scientistic and rationalistic Weltanschauung owes us all an explanation how their "rational" thought explains and - let's not forget - proves the "transformation" of non-organic matter into and organic one. i.e. the beginning of life: that's the KEY question, I think, and no one still has a CLUE about it: after answering to that in the same "rationalistic way" (proving it "scientifically") - evolution theory just could be true, I don't care. Then, and only then, you so-proud-I-have-a-brain-to-use "rationalist" guys would have a right to laugh your asses off. Cheers.

Thanks Risley & Drink for your mirrors.

goliardo you are welcome

Leaving the Evolution debate aside, some fanatics trying to portrait ancient Arab as an advanced civilization and ignorantly connecting it with Islam. Paganism was prevalent in Arab when it was an advanced civilization and doomed soon after Islam born in 7th century. The present Mecca was also a temple of ancient arabic Pagans. Freedom of thought and questioning the truth had been oppressed mercilessly. Quran in one hand and Sword in the other hand they spread Islam so quickly through out the Arab and killed peaceful and rationalist Paganism. Whatever the rationalists or scientists say, it is difficult to convince people who educated to believe that earth is just 6000 years old as preached by their religious texts.
After all "Ignorance is Bliss" for them.

Better proud of to be rational and to use the brain that proud of to be ignorant and to use the tongue only.
Más vale orgulloso de ser racional y usar el cerebro que orgulloso de ser ignorante y usar solo la lengua.

There is absolutely NO DOUBT, in the legitimate scientific community, that evolution is a scientific FACT and real. It is the entire basis of modern biology as well.

What gets creationists, and this is a misconception, is that they believe that it is about the origin of life. It is not, it is about the origin of species instead. Abiogenesis is about the origin of life. Plus, no, evolution doesn't necessarily exclude the concept of a god since, after all, it is not about the origin of life, nor of the universe either. To quote Darwin himself "I see no good reasons why the views given in this volume should shock the religious sensibilities of anyone." -- Charles Darwin, The Origin Of Species, 1869. Darwin also said that survival of the fittest wasn't survival of the strongest, nor of the most intelligent, but of the most responsive to change. And of course so-called "social-Darwinism" has absolutely NOTHING to do with biological evolution at all.

Another misconception that creationists have is that they believe that it says that we came from monkeys. Wrong, we share a common ancestor with the other apes, and only much further back with the monkeys. Yet another misconception is that an organism evolves into another one. They take this to mean that it evolves into an already existing creatures. Wrong yet again. an organism can evolve into a NEW species instead. Creationists get so much wrong that it makes one wonder if they're doing it on purpose or they're just completely ignorant of reality.

BTW, saying that evolution is "only a theory" shows that someone doesn't know what a scientific theory actually is. It is NOT a guess, it is a way of explaining something with the KNOWN FACTS. Gravity is a theory, and there is Germ Theory as well. In other words a scientific theory is about FACTS, not guesses. A hypothesis is a guess, and the stage before a theory.

Read and learn from real scientists.

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/evolution-fact.html

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-misconceptions.html

As for the evolution of the eye...

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB301.html

This "book" is nothing more than pseudo-science at its worse. All creationists are intellectually dishonest. Each and every criticism that creationists have against evolution is all based on either misconceptions or outright lies. If they actually had a close look at evolution they would see this, but of course they aren't willing to give up their popular myth for an unpopular truth.

Foub said it right and I'll repeat it:

"There is absolutely NO DOUBT, in the legitimate scientific community, that evolution is a scientific FACT and real. It is the entire basis of modern biology as well."

"This "book" is nothing more than pseudo-science at its worst. All creationists are intellectually dishonest. Each and every criticism that creationists have against evolution is all based on either misconceptions or outright lies. If they actually had a close look at evolution they would see this, but of course they aren't willing to give up their popular myth for an unpopular truth"

Who can spare us of these creationist bullshit?

What?? Ignore the facts or believe everything was "created" by a higher power, hmmm - I'll go with evolution/facts I'll try the higher power in the last moments of my life and see where i end up, but i say it'll be as dust.

Here is a link to creationist's claims about evolution and shows just how easily they are refuted.

http://talkorigins.org/indexcc/list.html

@Foub: Thanks, mate, for "clearing" up for me the difference between "facts", "scientific theories" and "hypothesis": I'm deeply grateful.
Read again what I said and you'll probably find out that I didn't mention "creationism", and I'm certainly not a "creationist" (this simplified division between "creationist" and "evolutionist" seems to exist only in the West, especially in the good ol' USofA). Anyway, in my book, a fact is 1+1=2, and evolution theory seems to be, even within a "legitimate scientific community" (whatever that is), 1+1="wait-until-we-come-up-with-something-better"-2: I trust you read regularly news from such fields as genetics, paleontology and similar - so, check your "facts" again (all other things you mentioned about evolution are, btw, well known to me: you see, I read Darwin and others, too, probably before you, maybe only for the simple fact that it was, for decades, "official truth" in my county...).
You seems to be a person who would say the "there is NO DOUBT, in legitimate scientific community" that a Big-Bang Theory is also a "scientific fact", now would you?
And about gravity: read about it, again, and you'll see that science CAN measure it, describe it or even, to certain point, "manage" it, but NO ONE actually knows the nature, the essence of that force - what it really IS.
I hope for no hard feeling here: for me, this is just a friendly exchange of opinions: the subject is to vast for this time and place. Regards.

Pleomax, smash yourself against the wall 10 times.
To death.
Don't forget to take this shameful parody of a book, totally based on ignorance and superstition, into this exciting preternatural quest to meet the Eternal Absolute Mind.

Praetorian. Just because we may not know everything about something doesn't mean that it isn't known enough of to be a fact. Nothing is 100%. Evolution is still accepted as a scientific fact even if we don't know every little thing about it, or that even some mechanisms are in dispute, there is still a consensus on the whole of it. The creationist would mistakenly use this to claim "GODDIDIT!!!" or that evolution as a whole is in dispute as well. Facts don't have to be 100% to be true. Read the link on evolution being both a fact and a theory.

Read my link to creationist's claims about evolution and you'll see that what you just said is also covered there. I'm not saying that you're a creationists, I'm only saying that they use the same statement about it not being 100% to dismiss it as a whole. Evolution is falsifiable (testable} and it is verifiable as well. There are literally mountains worth of evidence in favor of it.

In science facts can change when new, and verifiable, data comes along. This is how science works. Creationists want nothing to change. They want everything to stay the same because they don't want to learn anything new. This is one reason, among many, many, many other reasons why creationism is not and can never be a credible science.

As for the Big Bang that really wasn't brought up by a scientist, but a monk instead who was trying to combine science and religion. It was more like the Big Expansion instead. There is credible evidence that the universe is cyclical as well. It is the same with the so-called "missing link" question that was originally brought up by creationists to try and disprove evolution as well. There is no real missing link because we didn't evolve from apes. We are a species of ape.

this book is not really scientific! There are many flaws.
Harum Yahya is not a scientist, he is a dogmatist.

" Posted By: inuit Date: 06 Aug 2007 02:06
this book is not really scientific! There are many flaws.
Harum Yahya is not a scientist, he is a dogmatist. "

The flaw is in your mind.
Contact a good psychologist.

Thanks pleomax!
Seems like you hit a sore spot?
Do I smell books burning...

Sorry, been through all of the tired nonsense. Don't want to hear about the Paluxy tracks, tin
cups in coals seams, modern human remains in 30 million year old strata and the like. It's all
debunked easily in about 10 minutes worth of Googling. But the replies are never put into books
like this because books like this are all about truth and objectivity, right. And then these
liars accuse the scientists of lieing. Talk about hutzpa.

Harun Yahya is not a scientist, no scientist would debase himself by using a pseudonym (all readers, please check wikipedia for this "scientist"). And just let me quote from Shakepeare :

That which we call "creationism",
By any other name ("intelligent design" or whatever) would smell as shit.

Who is Harun Yahya?



Harun Yahaya is charlatan and a dangerous man. Here's some background of this great impostor:

Adnan Oktar (pen name: Harun Yahya) is claimed on his web page to be a 'world renown and respected scholar' who has devoted himself to writing about scientific and faith-related subjects such as the theory of evolution and miracles of God. He is further described by supporters as a respected 'scientist' who has publications in incredibly diverse areas of interest (actually he is not a university graduate).

The fact is that, his publications and his foundation (Science Research Foundation) have recently been banned in Turkey, and most members of his "sect" have been sent to court. This was not due to their Islamic and scientific activities, but due to crimes such as blackmail, extortion, possession of unlicensed weapons and sexual intercourse with minors.

About three years ago, upon complaints of victims and many years of suspicion, Turkish police raided residences of this group. The discoveries at the houses and testimony of the group members were shocking.

Under the mask of promoting Islam and scientific facts, the group members had been found to engage in extensive criminal activity. These crimes included blackmail, possession of unlicensed weapons and sexual intercourse with individuals under age 18.

The head of the group, Adnan Oktar (recorded by police cameras, leaked and shown on Turkish TV channels such as Kanal D, ATV, Star) confessed to blackmailing people who they regarded as an obstacle to their enterprises. These people included the reporters for the newspaper Hurriyet, Emin Colasan, and Fatih Altayli, after they questioned some of Harun Yahya's activities such as bribing the municipality of Ankara.

Also politicians such as Celal Adan (Member of the Parliament) and Mesut Yilmaz (former Prime Minister of Turkey) have been victims of this group. Oktar's group arranged fake (photomontage) photos of Mesut Yilmaz in Freemason clothes and ceremonies, and forged a fake certificate of Freemasonary for him. This fake was taken seriously and published in several pro-Islamic newspapers (without knowing it was a fraud). The PM was seriously damaged politically as a result during the remainder of his government.

Also coming forth, a fashion model named Ebru Simsek was blackmailed, and then slandered as a "prostitute" in fax messages sent to hundreds of different newspapers, TV channels, major business companies, foreign consulates, government offices etc. The reason for the slander? She refused to have sex with Adnan Oktar.

But the most shocking activities of Oktar's and his followers were not the above. In the sudden raid, 20 women and 2 other men were found at his residence. Most of the females (girls really) were under the age 18, (Oktar is his middle 40's) and they claimed that they had been having sexual intercourse with Oktar and members of his sect.

In his testimony, Oktar claimed that he had committed no crime as the intercourse was consensual, allowed under Turkish law. Further, Oktar insisted that this intercourse was also religiously permissible under Islam because he and his followers did not have a 'real sexual intercourse with these girls'.

He and his followers claimed that they had only engaged in 'anal and oral' sex. They preferred this kinds of sexual intercourse since according to Koran, he claimed, these acts are not impermissible outside of marriage. According to their interpretation 'vaginal' intercourse was 'haram' but 'anal and oral intercourse' was 'halal' when not married.

So you wonder what happened in the end?

Science Research Foundation was closed. Adnan Oktar (aka Harun Yahya), and about 40 of his sect members were taken to the court and judged. Once there, they denied the truth of their original confessions, claiming that they were extracted under torture.

The judicial process lasted over 2 years, during which most of the complainants' retracted their claims because of threats or bribes from sect members. As a result most of the cases against these people were dismissed, with only two of them jail for 1 year each.

That said, coverage of the arrests and trials were so extensive in Turkey that the reputation (and money making opportunities) of the group were permanently destroyed. It is now taken seriously only in foreign countries where their legal troubles received little or no press coverage.