Led Zeppelin Physical Graffiti - SSK 89400 UK Pressing (pbthal rip)

What an amazing sounding rip, it's blasting out right now on my stereo rig!!

Thanks to pbthal for this sonic wonder and added kudos to vinylsplendor for posting it here, as well as introducing pbthal's needle drops to Avaxhome! O happy days <<(:-})>>

A kick-ass upgrade compared to my Denon DL-304. Greatly appreciated ;)

Soooo kick-ass!! I have the CD of this and pbthal's rip sounds so much better, more detail with way more impact and depth. Thanks for this share!

OK. I downloaded this rip to see what is the big deal.

It is a good rip and a fairly good sound, but I don't see what everybody is creaming their shorts over.

The sound isn't as good as CD rip from a Jap collection and it isn't as good as the quality from a 24 bit/96 kHz rip.

But thanks anyway.

Great..now maybe you will leave your comments elsewhere instead of wasting your time on these...But thanks anyway

It's my time to waste. I don't understand the indignation. I didn't insult the rip.

However, I would waste even more time downloading the original 24 bit/96 kHz or 24 bit/192 kHz rips of these postings.

Maybe you can get back at me for your hurt feelings and post them and I can take the time to download them.

I'll get right on that...now go crawl back under your bridge

Simply amazing rip! I'm hearing small details never discerned before. Many thanks!!

pbthal

I read on the Song Remains the Same post that you would be posting this tonight. Is there somewhere you are posting these that is accessible to the average joe like me who just wants to download some great music. If you cant post the name maybe you can PM it to me.

Thanks for all the great rips already posted and for the others that I'm sure will come.

Thanks for putting these "24/96 always better" brainwashed types in their place pbthal_me.

This vinyl religion is gaining so much momentum that everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon, lest one feels one has missed something important, since others are running madly after it. Any disbelievers are then, obviously, castigated and derided, like BarryLyndon has been, which is, at a minimum, shameful. Why can't someone say that a vinyl rip is not sounding as good as a CD? Actually, most of them don't. Vinyls, leave alone their rips, cannot match the range of a digital media, which is precisely why genres like jazz and r&b sound crap on LPs. And imagine watching an action movie in a theater with its soundtrack playing on an LP! I am sure, pbthal would go to watch.

You people are a mad & deluded crowd, looking sideways for approval - to see if others are running along or not - and running forward. A tiny matter this, but gives important clues to how religious movements breed intolerance and violence by discouraging questioning.

As far as the gesture of sharing music is concerned, hats-off to all who take time out to do so. No question there!

First off...posting that any 24/96 would be better is ignorant. If I ripped a Columbia House pressing of Physical Graffiti on a USB Turntable at 192/24 it would in no way be better.

Second...if you like "Jap CD's" have at it, have some treble boost on me from 3rd generation master tapes.

Third...if you aren't into them then why not just shut the fuck up and move on

thanks so much for this,sounds the best ive heard this album ever..by the way ,vinyl and cd s both have flaws and advantages ,but at least i can turn up the volume listen to this rip and not have my ears bleed like they do from the remastered cd.

Is this a wrestling contest or what?
If you like the post fine, if not, it´s fine too but don´t use this forum to start personal issues.

Simply stunning.To download a humongous 24/96 rip and make a dvd-a,then hunt down a hardly plentiful piece of hardware to play the sucker on is hardly a sustainable activity.Give me great sound in the simplest most direct and accessible form anyday.MUSICALITY is what its all about.

P.S. I'm not Japanese.

pbthal rips=ROCK! I have the 2008 Led Zep Japanese SHM-CD's-those are solid and the best I have heard to date. But since this is a pbthal rip, I have to check it out. Much thanks!
If you see a rip by pbthal, get it, you will not be disappointed!

In this kind of free-for-all environment, trolling creatures like "barrylyndon" thrive on controversy and continuously pressing points they really know nothing about. For the likes of one or two like him, it'll always be a case of pearls to swine.

My only hope is that pbthal simply ignores these types of petty, mean-spirited comments and continues to provide us with talented rips such as this new one...which is a joyous sound experience, especially when compared with the imported Japanese CD version for which I paid dearly, only to find a dull-sounding and shrill sound field. It lacks the visceral impact and dynamics of the current rip, which is remarkable in so many ways.

Thank you, pb, your new issue is a total joy...selfishly looking forward to more!!

PS @jap2910 -
Very well put!

@amitnewyork

There *IS* actually some benefit of SOME vinyl rips over available CDs, and that is the quality of the source master. A lot of these SHM-CDs I'm seeing posted are done with later generation masters, and frankly, they sound awful. The advantage of a good vinyl rip from an early pressing is that it's more likely to have come from an earlier (or possibly original) generation master tape, and thus is likely to retain more of the dynamics of the original. Also, modern CD masters (especially the recent Led Zeppelin remasters) have a great deal of dynamic compression and increased volume, all of which compromises the quality of the resulting sound. These things weren't done on vinyl in the 70's, and the vinyl faithful doing rips are doing so at volumes that avoid clipping (the point where loud peaks in the music start getting distorted during playback). Thus, the likelihood of vinyl rips being better than MOST CDs is fairly high. This is not a guarantee, though, as some vinyl rips are done with lousy equipment, or ripped at lower sampling rates (thus losing some dynamics), or with dirty vinyl that causes those annoying pops and clicks.

pbthal (who did this rip with new equipment) is one of the more prolific and careful (even anal) vinyl rippers (or "needledroppers", if you like). I've done ABX comparisons between several of his rips and various "audiophile" CD pressings of the same albums. A lot of his results are dependent on the quality of his source vinyl. I've heard some of his rips that utterly destroy every available version of those albums (ie: Rush - Fly By Night, Alan Parsons Project - Turn of a Friendly Card), some that don't QUITE measure up to other available versions (I think I actually preferred the SHM-CD version of Zeppelin 3), and every rip of his that I've compared against an MFSL CD pressing of the same album has been nearly indistinguishable. In those latter cases, I prefer the MFSL version simply for cleanliness, but also take great comfort from having done the comparison, since it's a testament to the quality of pbthal's ripping process and equipment.

Now, would the high-resolution originals that pbthal uses to dither down to Redbook sound better than those resulting Redbook releases he provides? Sure. But what's more important is that the Redbook versions often still outshine any other digital copy of those CDs available for purchase, and that's good enough for 98% of the listening population. His rips aren't ALWAYS the best, but it's the case often enough to be worth the download and comparison to find out.

So I suggest avoiding both extremes: not all vinyl rips are automatically the Greatest Thing Ever, but nor should they be automatically dismissed. And pbthal's rips, given the consistent and prolific output, are more reliably high-quality, and thus always worth a try, even if there's already a "perfect" CD version available.

Keep it civil, folks. No need for the name calling.

ponchoman, you make very valid and intelligent points. Bottom line, a good (and I mean REALLY good) vinyl source combined with top-flight equipment and the kind of fanatical care taken by pbthal usually outshines the CD equivalent in many ways already outlined by others in this thread. In addition to the many outstanding pbthal rips I've heard, I point to a few others I admire and, frankly, have also blown my socks off. Givinback's recent rip of "Gaucho" is one of them, aksman's "Kind of Blue" is another that immediately come to mind. I keep an open mind about the vinyl vs. cd debate, but in the vast majority of cases, the really great needle drops have outshone their cd counterparts. My sound reference are B&W 801s driven by classic Conrad-Johnson PV series amp and preamp - as well as cultivated years of careful, critical listening.

And yes, let's please keep it civil. We're talking about recorded music, not religion or politics:)

"My sound reference are B&W 801s driven by classic Conrad-Johnson PV series amp and preamp - as well as cultivated years of careful, critical listening."

Besides the very nice sound toys, lawhou has also hit the nail on the head about "listening". It actually takes quite awhile to learn how to listen and I fear the proliferation of lossy digital formats combined with crappy computer audio solutions have many left without a clue as to what constitutes "good" sound.

I've been guilty of lumping all CDs in the crap catagory and in the first few production years they were! As time went on CDs definately improved and even though I still prefer vinyl, to totally disreguard any format as inferior is ludicrous.

I just want to say "Thanks and This Bud's for You" to all those that take the time to rip and share!

Interesting reactions...

Of course a 24-bit 96khz digital file would sound better than the exact same transfer dithered and resampled to 16-bit 44.1khz, but that's obvious ( or it should be). I would bet most people can hear the difference in higher resolution, you don't need to be an "audiophile", but of course having decent equipment is necessary. This may be the best vinyl transfer available, maybe even the best digital version available on Earth, but to reiterate the point, a higher resolution file would sound better. Why pbthal doesn't do resolution higher than 16/44.1, I don't know. Haven't seen a reason given anywhere.
I can think of some good possible reasons though - he doesn't have the hard drive space for the larger files; doesn't have the bandwidth available to upload the larger files; he thinks that most people would prefer 16/44 for ease of burning to CD ... those are the only legitimate reasons I can think of.

Thanks for sharing.

@SuperFuzz

He can speak for himself if he wants to reiterate it for about the 3000th time, but from what I understand, his reasons are 1) that MOST people don't have equipment that can handle 24/96 or 24/192 (iPods only handle 16/48); 2) most of the time the the audible difference between 24/96 and 16/44 is minimal (I have equipment that can handle it, and while I appreciate the higher resolutions, it really is pretty subtle, more subtle than the vast majority of people would notice; and 3) far too many have rather rudely demanded the hi-res versions without even giving his Redbook versions a chance (ie: BarryLyndon). I can imagine that he doesn't see much need to retain the hi-res rips if he doesn't use them in his own daily listening, and given how prolific an uploader he has been, the bandwidth required for him to provide the same number of releases in hi-res would be absolutely insane.

Sorry if I'm speaking out of turn, pbthal, but I imagine you're rather sick of answering the same questions over and over again.

Wow! Now this is amazing. It's not shrill on the ears. I can crank it up and not get a headache. I can't do that with any of the cd issues. Absolutely brilliant and warm. I can't believe at all that a 24/96 rip of this would sound any better at all. It's lossless, and that's what counts. Thank you Pbthal!

Nice to see pbthal rips showing up here. I was wondering where he might wander to after exhausting the last place of its usefulness.

I was a die-hard CD fanboy for the longest time, always berating the Vinyl format like some here do (blah-blah-blah-vinyl cannot match the digital range of CD-blah). Yes, I was one of the loudest trumpeters of such rhetoric.

That was until I heard a pbthal rip.

I even remember that day when I put it on and both my and my wife's jaw dropped to the floor. The title in question was Supertramp - Breakfast In America. The LP ripped was the original 1979 American pressing LP, bought used.

I have several pressings of this album, including the newest SHM-CD (ew), and the MFSL UDCD534, and I gotta be honest here, the LP rip smoked all of them. By leaps and bounds no less, the LP rip made my wife stare at the speakers in disbelief.

Thank you pbthal. Hope to see many more!

@ponchoman
Don't take it too seriously bro.
I guess I'm not really a cool person, as I don't hang out in the right places on the internets where I would have seen people asking 3000 times for a higher resolution share. If people were rude when asking, then that's not cool. It is however a sensible thing to simply ask "why not" share in higher resolution. It's no surprise that thousands of people have asked for higher resolution, because, well as I said, it would sound better, obviously, and sounding better is a good thing. But now I understand his reasons why (assuming you got his reasons correct, which I'm sure you did.) And that makes sense - as I said, a perfectly good reason to share in 16/44 is a belief that more people want it that way.

I've shared some less mainstream things in 24/96 on demonoid, no Beatles or Zep, so there's not been any discussion at all about my rips, and that's no surprise. But I welcome all comments, criticisms, and questions about my methods. The more people who are doing these things engage with others, then maybe more people will start doing a better job at this needledropping stuff, and we'll all be listening to some sweet sounds and maybe eventually wars will end and marijuana will be legalized.

I just did the first Van Halen record - well, not quite, but feel free to download part of the Hoffman/Gray and orig. WB versions and give me your input, good bad or whatever. http://www.demonoid.com/files/details/2037947/7015743/
I don't wear my heart on my sleeve, so I won't get offended at anything anybody ever says. It's just music anyway.

@ ponchoman – Agree with what you say, and HOW you say it. Wish people were nice to each other on forums like these. As digital audio imaging technology improves, we will hopefully see better CDs in future. The loudness wars doesn't help either. From what I have listened so far, the vinyl rips don't have much range, especially the low range. I can hardly hear the bass in all of them. Some recordings then, where the artist sings and plays mostly in midrange would appear to be beautiful on vinyls. How about a band like Porcupine Tree, which utilizes every bit of range from 20 to 20k Hz in its recording? I haven't heard any of its vinyl rips. It would be an interesting experiment if someone could rip one of their newer LPs. I'd love to compare them. Who better to do it than Mr pbthal? Listening, pal...eh?

I must say, so far, for me, XRCD sound remains the supreme followed by DVD-A by a good margin. Nothing else has come even closer to the XRCD experience. No wonder that quite a few jazz artists have chosen that format for their albums. It is a demanding genre that requires access to full range. And the XRCDs are all redbook audio CDs, which should silent those who keep asking for high-res data. What is needed is technology to more accurate digital image creation from the analog input, which means better ADCs and coders.

@amitnewyork

Keep in mind that jazz fans tend to fall more into audiophile territory than rock fans do. pbthal and some other rippers are filling in the gap for us rare rock fans who care about quality, who the record companies haven't seen as a large enough group to warrant extra effort and cost to provide for. pbthal is the ONLY one I know of who has provided any hard rock/metal (his Metallica rips are fantastic, and I feel shame the DCC audiophile CD pressings).

I'm surprised to see you say that vinyl rips have no range. My experience has been quite the opposite, especially with pbthal's rips, which have had NO weakness in the low-end at all. There are involved in keeping proper balance between the frequencies, like the character of the phono pre-amp, but as analog sources, vinyl should have MUCH greater frequency range to play with. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, though.

What is XRCD, anyway? If it's redbook standard (16/44), then it really shouldn't make much of a difference once ripped to WAV.

As far as vinyl rips of newer albums... I'm wary. I have a suspicion that they just use the same compressed, awful masters that get used for regular CD releases. I'd LOVE to hear if vinyl pressings of Opeth albums sound better than the CD versions, but I'm just not confident enough in the results to spend the money to explore it. Porcupine Tree is good stuff, though. Kudos there.

@ ponchoman

First, XRCD stands for (E)Xtra Resolution CD, which is an advanced digital imaging and manufacturing process developed by JVC. It uses K2HD coder that JVC has developed. While the analog signals are transferred at 24 bit to the K2 coder, the resolution is dynamically reduced to 16 bit to allow it to fit within a redbook CD. Visit www.xrcd.com for detailed info on how the technology works. There are plenty of them posted at this very forum. I urge you to please take some time out immediately to find what you're missing. My top picks are Flamengo Passion and Hell Freezes Over (Eagles). So far, I have nearly 80% of all catalog issued by Fim/Lim in USA. Their CDs are expensive, but I was able to garner them thru my audio club membership. Sound is just remarkable.

I'd love to hear a pbthal vinyl rip of a PT album. It'd be interesting to see how Edwin's bass & Gavin's drums come out in the rips. Also, some classic bossa nova & swing jazz material would also be fantastic. Well...whenever that be...

@ponchoman

I second amitnewyork's love of XRCD. Put your preconceived biases aside and check them out.
If you're an audiophile with a worthy CD player...I have a Cambridge 840C...you'll appreciate the fabulous sound of JVC's wonderful discs. Especially their jazz catalogue. Do yourself a favour and check out the XRCDs that are on Avax, Vanpelten has put up a number of them, mostly jazz. Do a search under under his handle. I don't know if I agree about them being superior to DVD-Audio, though, especially when many of the DVD releases feature multichannel. When it comes down to it, I'm "format neutral" and only judge from what I hear, regardless of the medium.

Good thread guys, I wish everyone was this thoughtful and civil:)

PS for ponchoman and anyone else into XRCD: http://avaxhome.ws/music/jazz/Bill_Evans_Village_Vanguard_JVC_XRCD.html ----- http://avaxhome.ws/music/format_bitrate/lossless/t_bennett_evans.html

So the max 80dB dynamics vinyl ripped to 24bit/192kHz through a E-MU 1212 crap? Talk about overkill.

Do you technical myth folks travel in packs?

Let me drop some real world info on you

The E-MU 1212 uses the AK5394A chip for its Analog to Digital conversion (The only thing we care about in making a recording)

Guess what else uses the same chip?

Benchmark Media ADC1
Digidesign ProTools HD 192 I/O Interface

So now that we have that piece cleared up. On to SHM-CD and CD in general

Does anyone know why I generally don't record Japanese vinyl..I will tell you why...because

A. The tapes used to make the vinyl and/or CD is at least one generation removed from the master.
B. The Japanese are known to boost highs and lows that may sound pleasing on its own but when compared to an original sourced transfer is inferior and not by a subtle margin.
C. In 95% of the cases I will take a "best source" vinyl rip over a 3rd generation sourced CD anyday. There are very few CD's that I find beat a great vinyl rip.

I am not going to delve into the myth of SHM-CD as I this is not what this thread is about but I will say if you enjoy them ..great.

Thank you for sharing this vinyl rip with us. Sounds great! Brings back great memories. I remember buying this album when it first came out and wearing it out on a turntable/setup that probably cost less than just your cartridge alone. lol

Keep up the great work and thanks again for sharing them with us.

Thank you very much!!!

sadly the files have been blocked :(